My Coffee Spits Everywhere!

System

I am by no means an expert but I have been using a basic Breville expresso machine for a few years and just love my coffee.

The machine was working fine but recently I can't seem to get the flow right. It sprays hisses and steams all over the cups and there is no crema at all. I tip it all out, set it up again and it flows perfectly and gives a beautifull crema.

I don't know what I'm doing wrong or if it is the machine, I have tried varying everything I do, tamping pressure etc.....

Any ideas?  :-?

admin

HI Cm - sounds weird that this has only started happening recently, and by the sounds of things, even then, it's intermittent?? Will try and ask one of the experienced guys to give an opinion on this for you. -A

flatwhite

Do you do your milk first?  Could be that there is too much steam/pressure in the boiler, your first run relieves the pressure and the second one turns out alright.  Try running water through the group until it stops spitting then put the handle in.  

askthecoffeeguy

Not sure what sort of seals the machine has but it could well be that the seals need replacing. You can contact your local supplier to find out about the replacement parts, or log onto coffeeparts.com.au Alternatively, it could be that the shower screen on the unit needs cleaning or replacing, and the lines cleaned / descaled. If you do a google search you can find out more about this process. It's also a good idea to take your machine in for a regular service, about once per year, whether you think it needs it or not. And if you think that the cost of the service is a bit expensive,  maybe its time to start thinking about buying a new machine! Fresh Coffee can probably help you out there.... Hope this helps, Pat

FreshCoffee2

Fresh Coffee can probably help you out there.... Hope this helps, Pat

I appreciate your confidence in me Pat but I am afraid in this instance, that unless I can see what the machine is doing right in front of me, I wont be able to venture an opinion. The salient points (for me) are, that the machine has been runing fine until recently when it apparently developed an intermittent fault. Intermittent faults can't be diagnosed unless you catch them while they're happening. I will however indulge myself (and you all) with one crystal ball observation: Assume its a thermoblock machine. On an aged machine there is the possibility that the seal in the thermoblock has failed and the thermoblock is leaking. There is therefore the possibility that if the operator "catches" the machine at a point where it has been sitting a little while and air has found its way back into the thermoblock from the leak, then that would be the time it will be likely to spit a kind of steamy, aerated flow etc. Once the pump pressurises the thermoblock up with a full charge of water again it would then appear to run fine for the next coffee, but you might go through all the above again as water leaks out of the thermoblock and lets air back in, betwen this and the next brewing cycle..... In which case this should be accompanied by some kind of leak from the machine. Hope this helps, but please appreciate this cant diagnosed without pulling the body away to check and even then, if this turned out to be the case,

Unknown

Thanks guys, lots to think about  . I will show 'er indoors the bit about buying a new machine  :-*

askthecoffeeguy

Fresh Coffee can probably help you out there.... Hope this helps, Pat

I appreciate your confidence in me Pat but I am afraid in this instance, that unless I can see what the machine is doing right in front of me, I wont be able to venture an opinion.

BobHickman

You are grinding your coffee too finely. If you unscrew the plastic insert in your group handle, you will notice a build up of coffee around the cross members of the spouts. You will have to clean this thoroughly, then check that you have not torn the rubber seal that the group head handle presses against. This seal will rupture due to the pressure build up of the blocked system.

Lacehim

Welcome Bob, but I would have thought he would have figured it after after 7 years!  ???  ::)  :P

BobHickman

You are probably right. Crashman, the original poster, may well have solved the problem a long time ago.However, If a person having exactly the same problem today types into Google "why is my coffee machine spitting?", this site comes up first in the list. Judging by the 1300 people who have read the thread so far, I would say the problem is fairly common and I'm sure visitors to the site would like help with it. In fact, I visited the site several months ago, but there was nothing here to help me at the time. So like Crashman has probably done, I figured out the problem myself; the only difference was, I wanted to share what I had learnt with other people who were suffering the same fate. You see, it's one of those problems where the very thing you think will fix the problem is actually the thing exacerbating it. The more your coffee machine spits and splutters, the more finely you grind your coffee in the hope that this will 'unclog' the flow. The problem is, it does exactly the opposite - and to be honest, I would not be surprised if many coffee machine owners just gave up and threw the machine in the bin and went back to good old fashioned instant coffee. Personally, I think that would be a pity and I was just trying to save some machines from extinction.

Koffee_Kosmo

on 1392253018:

You are probably right. Crashman, the original poster, may well have solved the problem a long time ago.However, If a person having exactly the same problem today types into Google "why is my coffee machine spitting?", this site comes up first in the list. Judging by the 1300 people who have read the thread so far, I would say the problem is fairly common and I'm sure visitors to the site would like help with it. In fact, I visited the site several months ago, but there was nothing here to help me at the time. So like Crashman has probably done, I figured out the problem myself; the only difference was, I wanted to share what I had learnt with other people who were suffering the same fate. You see, it's one of those problems where the very thing you think will fix the problem is actually the thing exacerbating it. The more your coffee machine spits and splutters, the more finely you grind your coffee in the hope that this will 'unclog' the flow. The problem is, it does exactly the opposite - and to be honest, I would not be surprised if many coffee machine owners just gave up and threw the machine in the bin and went back to good old fashioned instant coffee. Personally, I think that would be a pity and I was just trying to save some machines from extinction.

Thanks for taking the time and your fix it post Bob And I am sure it will help others for sure KK

BobHickman

It also seems you should put fewer coffee beans in the grinder. The more you put; the longer you have to grind. This means by the time you have ground all the beans, a good sized portion of them have been ground to a fine powder, which is what seems to cause the problem. I don't know exactly how many beans one should place in the grinder, though. Perhaps that is something an admin could offer to the thread.

Koffee_Kosmo

on 1392264965:

It also seems you should put fewer coffee beans in the grinder. The more you put; the longer you have to grind. This means by the time you have ground all the beans, a good sized portion of them have been ground to a fine powder, which is what seems to cause the problem. I don't know exactly how many beans one should place in the grinder, though. Perhaps that is something an admin could offer to the thread.

That depends on the grinder one uses and if it is fit for purpose Most members on this forum grind on demand and load the grinder with only the amount of beans required for that shot Members of Crema also know that - Correct adjustment of the grinder is an ongoing proses of small grind adjustments that can change with many factors For example - Age of beans , ambient temperature  -as in winter/summer, humidity and bean type / origin It's not as cut and dry as it first appears Every user has a challenge to use the equipment to archive its best performance KK

mycuppa

Most grinders, particularly larger or commercial styles with conical type burrs, do not operate consistently if there is an insufficient quantity of beans in the hopper. The weight of the beans is required to apply downward pressure to reduce beans jumping. The last 50g or handful of beans sitting in the hopper may be ground with some inconsistent particle sizes. Fact - not internet fiction !

Koffee_Kosmo

All true I use a home made devise that is fashioned on a Hacky sack Works wonders Something like this Attachment not found.

BobHickman

Well there ya go. Thanks Koffee Kosmo. I put half the amount of ground coffee beans in my group head handle as I normally do - and bingo - not a spit or splutter. It poured perfectly. So now the next thing is - how do I get the crema?

Koffee_Kosmo

on 1392275709:

Well there ya go. Thanks Koffee Kosmo. I put half the amount of ground coffee beans in my group head handle as I normally do - and bingo - not a spit or splutter. It poured perfectly. So now the next thing is - how do I get the crema?

I can't answer the question about your Crema until you post the equipment you currently use and where you purchase youre coffee and it's age As a general rule - Fresh coffee will always produce more Crema that old coffee

BobHickman

Well actually I have a sunbeam, which I don't think is much different to the Breville that Crashman, the original poster, had. In fact, I had a Breville, too, that developed the same problem. But look, I thought about what you said, and I got to thinking that I may be on the wrong track altogether. The problem could be that I am just putting way too much ground coffee in the group head handle, which is being caused by two reasons really. Firstly, these coffee machines that we buy from Big W etc come with a plastic tamping thing. The other problem is the instructions make it clear you have to tamp the coffee down - but I'm starting to think that to allow you to do that, you have to put in so much coffee that the machine starts to spit and splatter. So after reading what you had to say about only putting in enough coffee for one cup, I decided to put in about a teaspoon of ground coffee, about the same amount as one would use for a cup of instant coffee - and I tamped it down with the teaspoon. The result wasn't great, but at least the machine didn't spit and splutter - and the coffee was still ok.

Koffee_Kosmo

Every machine has an optimum tamp depth On my PF  filter basket it's 8mm For any machine you need to find the optimum coffee depth with a little trial an error 1st - tamp as normal - then lock in the PF 2nd - Undo it and see if the coffee has hit the water screen If it has touched the water screen, just remove some coffee with a brush and re-tamp - and repeat step one If there is no mark then add a little more coffee and re-tamp - and repeat step one Your goal is to just have the two surfaces touch or just miss by a hairs whisker Then take note of that depth and tamp to that depth every time KK

UNM

well this thread seems to have got lively again! Anyhoo Bob, just wondering whereabouts you are in case any friendly members might be nearby to supply you with some quality fresh coffee and perhaps  first hand advice. Also, what sort of grinder? It isn't one of those whirly blade grinders is it?  If so, that may well be part of  the problem - amount of coffee you grind will certainly have a big impact on the evenness of grind in that style of grinder.

C-man

he could be using the double floor baskit

BobHickman

I don't think it would help to have somebody come visit me. I'm having exactly the same problem as Crashman. It starts off ok, but then it progressively gets worse. At first, I thought it was something to do with the filter basket so I bought some cleaning brushes and some coffee machine cleaner from the local kitchen shop. None of that seemed to help, so I went off the idea. Now I'm starting to think it is the filter basket after all. I have several and most of them won't even allow water only to pass through the handle. This makes me think there is some build up going on inside the walls. How do you guys clean your filter baskets? Or do you simply replace them every few months.

Koffee_Kosmo

To clean filter baskets and the metal parts of the PF One simply adds the correct amount of water and back flush detergent and soak overnight, then rinse in the morning

BobHickman

All right. I did that before, but it didn't seem to make a difference, but I will do it again. The directions for the premium espresso machine cleaner product I have say I should use one tablespoon of the powder mixed with one litre of hot water, which I have done. So I shall wait and see if that makes a difference. I noticed somebody suggested I may be using double skin filter baskets. I am actually. Is that a mistake? Should I be using single skin baskets?

BobHickman

Actually, cleaning the filter baskets may have worked this time. I did as the instructions told me to do, but I went a step further. I sprinkled half a teaspoon of powder in the filter basket, placed it in the handle and then in the machine. After that, I pumped a little water into the filter basket and let it soak for quarter of an hour. Then I ran loads of water through it. I did this a couple of times, until the flow seemed consistent and there was no evidence of spitting or spluttering. Once I did this, I made a cup of coffee and it was perfect - just as good as the day I bought the machine. It's early days yet, but I reckon this may have been the problem all along. It fits with how Crashman described the problem in the first place. As the filter becomes more and more blocked up, the machine finds it harder to force water through the little holes - and it spits back.

Koffee_Kosmo

The double skin baskets will clog and block more often and should be washed as often as possible The double basket was designed to produce Crema from old beans The way it works is like a water hose spray adjuster - it aerates the liquid under pressure Try it both ways ( with or without the second basket) and use what you are comfortable with Just remember that you are in charge of the result when using a single basket Grind, tamp, fresh coffee and it could be a steep learning curve and very frustrating KK

Ol Grumpy

on 1392339250:

<snip> and it could be a steep learning curve and very frustrating KK

And an 'Amen' to that... Need lots of patience and perseverance...

C-man

Everyone is  being too kind to this newbie and he is not getting the message, don't sugar cote it, tell it to him straight! Dude, the double floor baskets are for "chumps" that know nothing about making coffee and buy supermarket crap beans toss them and only use a single floor  basket and start making real coffee and you will be a hero at home. Most cheap machines do not come with them so if you don't have one order it from Coffee parts, delivery is super fast! Even a cheap machine will pull a nice tiger striped shot with a single floor basket and some good beans from a Roaster. those are facts so get with it and stop trying to over think things.  also remove any crap plastic things inside the portafilter I say no more......

Brett H

on 1392372278:

I say no more......

Shame, I like what your saying.  I only want to add that without a capable grinder (this will have cost the equivalent or mare than your appliance) you've Buckley's and none of making good espresso.  Am I a snob who insists you spend a fortune on equipment, suggesting you can't have great coffee without great equipment?? NO.  Great coffee is fresh roasted, stored appropriately and ground appropriately as required.  If you get that right, there are still countless ways to make horrible coffee.  Knowledge and practise... Good luck.

BobHickman

yup - that seems to have done the trick. Two days later and my coffee is still pouring perfectly - crema n all Sorry about all the posts guys, but the problem was a pain and I was desperate. I really didn't want to buy another machine so I thought I would just make an arrogant post, in the hopes that someone would refute my claims and get to the solution real fast. Never mind, we got there in the end - and for any newbie visitors to the site in search of a solution to the very same problem, the cleaning product I use for my filter baskets is called Caldo Caffee - Premium Espresso Machine Cleaner. The only thing I do differently is place a little powder in the bottom of the filter basket and run water through it from the coffee machine. It seems to work a treat.

Brett H

on 1392525443:

yup - that seems to have done the trick. Two days later and my coffee is still pouring perfectly - crema n all Sorry about all the posts guys, but the problem was a pain and I was desperate. I really didn't want to buy another machine so I thought I would just make an arrogant post, in the hopes that someone would refute my claims and get to the solution real fast. Never mind, we got there in the end - and for any newbie visitors to the site in search of a solution to the very same problem, the cleaning product I use for my filter baskets is called Caldo Caffee - Premium Espresso Machine Cleaner. The only thing I do differently is place a little powder in the bottom of the filter basket and run water through it from the coffee machine. It seems to work a treat.

Great news Bob!  We're quite a friendly forum so hopefully you'll stick around; and, if there are any issues further down the track just ask and you'll receive!