Do coffee drinkers care?

Dry_bean.

Interesting article in the SMH http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/chocolate-sweetened-with-ethics-20110319-1c199.html
The figures surprise me (if they are correct) Last year Australians spent $87 million on Fairtrade chocolate compared with $50 million on Fairtrade coffee, I wonder what the total Aussie yearly spend was on coffee beans from all sources? perhaps someone in the industry can answer the question.
And what do the numbers mean, do we consume more chocolate per head than coffee, are chocolate eaters/drinkers more warm and fuzzy/gullible than coffee drinkers, are the figures meaningless because chocolate is a more expensive commodity than coffee.

WotB

Does Fairtrade actually address exploitation of child labour?  I'm not so sure.  Fairtrade seems to be more of a marketing vehicle than anything else these days. Re: Ethical/sustainable practices, traceability is the biggest issue.  I'm sure that in the future, like coffee, there will be more and more emphasis on direct trade.  That is where the people who care will source their product.

Dry_bean.

The reality is of course that as long as we have third world countries we will have poverty and child/subsistence level labour and as long as the human race continues to procreate at ever increasing rates we will have have poverty. So while the feel good organisations are busy putting out spot fires the vast majority of these populations are sinking even further into the mire. I don't see a solution to the problem, countries like Australia could devote their entire economy toward the problem and it would have no affect. ??? 

blanyon

I would think it is because the standard chocolate, ie cadburys, is fair trade so there isn't a premium to purchase the product whereas with coffee there is (IMHO) an astronomical markup on fair trade so consumers have to actively make the choice to pay more. It would be interesting to know how much extra of the chocolate fair trade money actually gets to farmers as opposed to coffee.   I do have a problem with the way fair trade is structured but it is better that nothing, direct trade seems to be a better model but for the bulk market I'm not sure it is the answer. Brett

Dry_bean.

on 1300608505:

I'm not sure it is the answer. Brett

Is there an answer?

blanyon

There is never one answer, generally the market will decide what the answer is any interference from industry/government tends to distort the market and cause problems unseen at the beginning. Coffee farmers (and most farmers in general) supply a commodity market and so are price takers, if there are big players buying the goods then they will run the market and screw prices down to as close to production level as possible to maximise their return. Anyway I am getting into a big rant late at night, I grew up on a farm and the pricing of commodity products always gets on my nerves. I am doing my bit to increase consumption of quality coffee and hopefully lifting prices for quality coffee producers. Brett 

beanflying

Fairtrade is a CROCK and a marketing tool! When you look at $ in to $ back on the ground it is one of the worse performing assistance programs out there. The big chocolate players USE it to excess while the Latte sipping mummies on a morning out just feel oh so much better that they only drink 'Fairtrade' or 'Rain Forest Alliance' bird faeces friendly coffees. Rant over now ;D

Dry_bean.

on 1300680247:

Fairtrade is a CROCK and a marketing tool! When you look at $ in to $ back on the ground it is one of the worse performing assistance programs out there. The big chocolate players USE it to excess while the Latte sipping mummies on a morning out just feel oh so much better that they only drink 'Fairtrade' or 'Rain Forest Alliance' bird faeces friendly coffees. Rant over now ;D

Pleased to know I'm not the only cynic on this forum, mind you a healthy dose of cynicism is not such a bad thing. Take everything at face value and you will go like a lamb to the slaughter.

askthecoffeeguy

True but a small amount of money can still go a long way in a third world environment, and having met the fair-trade coffee farmers from the okapa region in the png highlands I can attest that the school and hospital there would not have been built any other way - and that the hospital is saving lives every single day Sure fair trade has it's fair share of problems but it can and does make a difference in the world when properly utilised, not everyones cup of tea for sure - but don't write it off altogether P

beanflying

To save the boredom of reading their last years Annual Report here is the summary. About 1/2 of the income from fees etc is chewed up in wages for a start and so on it goes. Apart from the price paid to the Co-Op in the source country I fail to see any direct benefit of using or suggesting FT certified in Oz. Their stated aims Fairtrade ANZ

askthecoffeeguy

To me there's no question that ft has made inroads to poverty in some instances and there are without doubt some excellent ft coffees around (as well as a lot of terrible ones) - at the end of the day I credit the customer with the ability to make informed choices not only about whether they choose to endorse ethically sourced coffees (including ft) - but also to vote with thier feet, afrerall it's what's in the cup that counts, and no amount of whimsical endorsement can desguise a crap coffee After all there are plenty of places that sell crap ft coffee, and their are plenty of coffee companies big sbs small who are willing to put out sub standard ft coffee products into the market place, in order to claw back some market share - but it it's not rocket science to be able to sort the shite from the shanolla, and a discerning customer is not going to undefinitrly endorse an inferior product At my last cafe we sticked a single origin ft coffee product as our main coffee - and sold in excess of 800 coffees per day - don't think the customers would've kept coming back if the quality wasn't there - which to me only goes to show that it can be done well if that is your intention Which is not to say that their is not more 'ethical' and great quality coffees out there - which potentially offer a better return to the farmer - but ft can also make an enormous impact when done properly

WotB

As an aside, try finding a genuine charity that has minimal admin costs. Single digit percentages of proceeds going to where they're needed is often the order of the day.

beanflying

Agreed FT is certainly never a guarantee it tastes good. I had a great FT Columbian on last weekend as a S/O but the fact that it was FT was not the reason  A bit like not all Organics taste like dirt just some of them. It is more the way that FT puts themselves across as a charitable wonderful organisation out to solve the evils of the world by simply buying a badged product. In truth they are a not for profit marketing and certification program with a reasonable set of ethical buying principles but that simply doesn't play as well with the average Latte drinker as the spin.

Dry_bean.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/millions-go-missing-from-australias-overseas-aid-program/story-e6frea6u-1226027066436 Why am I not surprised? >:(

Dry_bean.

on 1300929407:

And people are surprised at this ? 

Not in the least AM, but then I've been told time and again I'm a cynical old bastard. You ask do we turn a blind eye? no, but I suspect the average donor is looking at the situation through rose coloured glasses, never realising that only a few cents of every dollar donated ever make it to the intended recipients, charity and overseas aid are enormous industries employing tens of thousands of people world wide. If we donate to Aussie based charities most of the funds will be eaten up in administration and very little will ever reach the intended recipients, if we send the funds directly to charitable organisations in the countries we are trying to help most if not all will be skimmed by corrupt bureaucrats. So many questions so few answers. :-\

beanflying

As we were nominally talking FT which is effectively OXFAM. Their Annual report shows around 75% of $$ being used for program delivery offshore. The cynic in me would still like to know if that is after staff wages or before? Some of the direct relationship coffee projects undertaken locally and overseas make a lot of sense to the coffee industry as they can make a positive effect on the $$ received for the crop by increased local processing/knowledge and increased quality for us

Koffee_Kosmo

Charity is big business And I mean BIG KK