Breville's new dual boiler machine BES900

E61

Hi Guys,

For those of you who have been eargerly awaiting news of the new machine by Breville.

It is being released at the SCAA show in Houston on the 28th.

Mark Prince (Coffeegeek) has promised to send us some pics so stay tuned for an exclusive CREMA forum scoop!  ;D

Matt

Shuttle Control

E61

I suspect that there will be a review on an American forum, which whilst not as good as good as Crema is still fairly well known  ;D Anyway - at least it will go some way to stop the teasing by Breville here. Clever marketing strategy - it's certainly got everyone talking!

E61

If reliability is then proven and their Grinder is matched; then a lot more of the general public will be on the coffee road.

I hope this machine stands up too. Bundled with a Smart Grinder it would be an awesome package. It would also send a strong message to the "Made In China" detractors. Sadly for the small specialty retailers I suspect it may not be viable to range but will very likely represent good value from the bigger retailers. If it was ranged by a speciality retailer the added benefit for users would be training and stronger support. I hope the new Breville machine does stand up. It might end up being a competitor, however, it might also provide an opportunity for more people to begin a love affair with coffee - and that's a good thing 

Koffee_Kosmo

I don't have any interest in this machine and this is probably the first post I have made on a Breville related thread If I was to put my designer hat on I would design for robustness first and if there is room in the budget and final price structure to add features then you add the practical ones before the afterthought ones Human nature dictates that in most cases people don't know what they want until they try However in most cases they know what the don't want/like from previous experience Its far better to ask what you hate/not like and don't include it KK

RichardM

Finally, can talk about this honestly..... I've been following this machine with interest, and thinking the unreliability issues of the 6910 (not first hand experience) makes me worry about the electronic component of machines made in China, as I feel like there is one group doing electronics, one group doing the "hot bit" and then piece it together and hope the hot bit doesn't kill the electronic bit. It could make the best coffee in the world, but if the reliability isn't there, there will be a huge backlash, especially at a $1k-1.5k price point. Any talk of it now is absolutely pointless because of this in my opinion. I can't see people walking into a shop paying that much for a manual machine personally, but we'll see. I stand by my previous comments about it being more likely to eat into top end market share, not bottom end. It's not like the people buying in this price point (which doesn't currently exist) would go without - they'd be the people currently buying the lower end HX's, thus it will shake up the market, but not necessarily in a good way. I still think it will just drive a wedge in the market as opposed to being healthy competition. I don't want bling like actively heated group handles etc. It says to me they're designing for the lowest common denominator and that they will market it as "no heat up time!" on the box.

WotB

Re: Electronics bit and longevity. I don't see Breville coming up with a manual lever machine anytime soon. The problem lies in trying to do too much, and relying on electronics to keep everything in a small package. With hot things, the less electronics the better.

RichardM

on 1303446117:

With hot things, the less electronics the better.

Absolutely. I work on photocopiers every day, that run at temps not dissimilar to coffee machines, and their electronics are VERY well separated from the hot bits. It astounds me the design of these consumer machines that have a large portion of electronics that suffer such temperature swings.

Koffee_Kosmo

A combination of 1) Heat 2) Fluid under high pressure 3) Electronics Is very hard to achieve while encapsulated in a small package Fluid under pressure and materials used is actually the most critical Heat is next and electronics not designed to operate excesses heat will fail prematurely KK

E61

I see David from Breville has joined us - Welcome David! Please - No teasing about the new machine!  ;D We want the low down now - specs, price, boiler material (brass or stainless) and to finally squash the rumours once and for all that the new machine will be called the "Bliss" 

David Gubbin

on 1303540036:

on 1303535075:

I see David from Breville has joined us - Welcome David! Please - No teasing about the new machine!  ;D We want the low down now - specs, price, boiler material (brass or stainless) and to finally squash the rumours once and for all that the new machine will be called the "Bliss" 

There is enough over the WEB,  Twitter and FaceBook as to the new machine, but is there a handshake; as to who gets an inside running  ::) Or as usual;  Australia gets told one thing and then when released / on show OS, the grape vine is faster and more precise with a corrected update  8) Either way, all the conjecture is positive from a marketing point of view  :D

Couple of points. Firstly, hi. Secondly, we can't pretend all is positive on the site, but so be it. When we sell toys, those in the know deserve to grade us poorly. Thirdly, AM, Breville is a Sydney based company. We don't take the lead from a multi-national corporate, we run our own race. The 240v variant will be the first released, however saying that the 110v (USA) won't be far behind. The temp consistency has been achieved off of 1800watts so it's essentially the same machine with a different plug on it. But Aus consumers will see it first. Fourthly, I made a mistake on CS. The machine will be at SCAA, however will not be at the show itself and will be shown under NDA's. 5ly, we are trying to keep a few secrets to ourselves until the launch on the17th. But it's proving difficult with the breadth of people that have seen it so far. .....ly, it's all turned into a bit of a game, which was not the intention. We're still tweaking PP's and are still achieving the temp results and have improved steam again over the past week. All will be revealed on the 17th. But to be honest, I'm sure someone will let the cat out of the bag before. Lastly, it will not be called the bliss. Lastly, we'll not be promoting "no heat up time". The "bling" of a actively heated group head was not designed as bling. We simply laid down a super tight performance tolerance to the designers, so the AHGH, was deemed just as important as pid's, non-thermoblocketc etc, in achieving those tolerances.

David Gubbin

on 1303535075:

I see David from Breville has joined us - Welcome David! Please - No teasing about the new machine!  ;D We want the low down now - specs, price, boiler material (brass or stainless) and to finally squash the rumours once and for all that the new machine will be called the "Bliss" 

Dual SS Boilers

RichardM

on 1303586382:

Couple of points. Firstly, hi. ....... Lastly, we'll not be promoting "no heat up time". The "bling" of a actively heated group head was not designed as bling. We simply laid down a super tight performance tolerance to the designers, so the AHGH, was deemed just as important as pid's, non-thermoblocketc etc, in achieving those tolerances. .... Dual SS Boilers

Hi I didn't mean to offend with the "bling" side of things. I was more just making a point of concern about the extra electronics being integrated into a machine that is essentially putting as much heat out as a small fan heater. I'd love to hear more about the internal layout of the machine, and how the electronics is shielded from the heat. SS Boilers seem like an adequate compromise over brass for a cost, and, while not a negative in any way towards Breville, will still provide a differentiation between this machine and the more expensive dual boilers (ie Expobar) and the Italian HX machines.

admin

Hi David - welcome to the forum & thanks for the update ... can't wait to see the real thing.

E61

Hi Guys - for those of us intrigued by the new machine from Breville it's been an interesting exercise trying to determine what was is fact and what is just wild rumour and guessing concerning the specs. In other places there has been a frenzy of leaks and guessing but I thought it might be a good opportunity to summarise what is actually known so far. (As confirmed by Dave from Breville) Outside it will: 1. Have a brushed Stainless Steel exterior 2. Have 2 PID controllers 3. Have a water guage 4. Have a pressure guage 5.   Have an Actively Heated Group Head 6.   Have a SS Filter Holder Inside it will: 1. Have twin stainless steel boilers 2. Have an Italian vibe pump 3. Have OPV (Over pressure Valve) 4. Have Built In Power on Timer 5.   Have a 1800W Element We also know it won

David Gubbin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NgNHfvZKDxo&sns=em A quick naked clipnfrom yesterday.

Vinitasse

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that info on this shiny new toy has dried up somewhat... even on that other forum? Could this possibly hint at troubles in paradise or even a delay in the product launch? And speaking of things drying up... somewhat off topic I know... but I have definitely noticed a change at that other site as well... with the vast migration of key contributors to this forum the flow of information over there seems to be slowing down as well

RichardM

on 1304143023:

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that info on this shiny new toy has dried up somewhat... even on that other forum? Could this possibly hint at troubles in paradise or even a delay in the product launch?

On topic....I don't think the info has dried up...I just think that there's nothing left to give away. I've said it before and I'll say it again - I don't care what the specs are. Reliability FIRST, specs second. Won't know the real answer to that question until at least a few months after it's released. Until then, I won't recommend it to anyone.

shape_shifter

I'm waiting to see if anyone's sprung leaking information from the SCAA, surely they wouldn't

Koffee_Kosmo

I'll say it again - I don't care what the specs are. Reliability FIRST, specs second. Won't know the real answer to that question until at least a few months after it's released. Until then, I won't recommend it to anyone.

The best test is a hidden camera test Give the product away and observe through hidden camera footage an inexperienced user destroy or master the product Even we in the know sometimes look through rose coloured glasses KK

shape_shifter

Kick it to me :D We'll either master it or make it better :D

David Gubbin

on 1304143023:

Is it just me or has anyone else noticed that info on this shiny new toy has dried up somewhat... even on that other forum? Could this possibly hint at troubles in paradise or even a delay in the product launch? And speaking of things drying up... somewhat off topic I know... but I have definitely noticed a change at that other site as well... with the vast migration of key contributors to this forum the flow of information over there seems to be slowing down as well

We're still on time guys. And lucky enough to get a kick on steam performance at this late stage thanks to a minor tweak. All good. No legal issues to be concerned about.

David Gubbin

on 1303432596:

Hi Guys, For those of you who have been eargerly awaiting news of the new machine by Breville. It is being released at the SCAA show in Houston on the 28th. Mark Prince (Coffeegeek) has promised to send us some pics so stay tuned for an exclusive CREMA forum scoop!  ;D Matt Shuttle Control

I'm pretty sure rob the designer is meeting mark today and already showed it to one of marks key guys at SCAA last week as it's popped up on his thread. Touch wood, everyones respected the NDA so far, despite us giving away almost everything.

E61

on 1304542478:

I'm pretty sure rob the designer is meeting mark today

Apparently Rob gave Mark some "great insights into the Australian espresso market" Would have loved to have  been a fly on the wall at that discussion 

askthecoffeeguy

could this be a sneak peak at the new machine? p

Rider

No mate, That looks like the Fresca with the built in grinder. Apparently the new one won't have a grinder in it.

shape_shifter

New clip showing the Breville pulling a 37 second shot. and a 34 second

shape_shifter

That's the problem I have, is the noise, the initial videos weren't so loud, I don't know whether that was just due to the microphone.  I'll have to wait and see in the flesh before I make up my mind.

DoubleRistretto

on 1305354628:

I close my eyes and hear a Sunbeam or any other Vibe pump machine.  They forgot to turn the mike down...... Regardless of marketing, I will reserve any comments until I see and play with one in the flesh and it has been in use for >6 months.

yep, sounds a bit like a Sunbeam to me, but beautiful-looking unit... guess the proof of the pudding will be in the eating. Either way, looks like the Breville marketing team have got the Apple 'social media' thing working well - "top secret, but make sure everyone knows about it" dR

Bottom Line

on 1305412114:

Either way, looks like the Breville marketing team have got the Apple 'social media' thing working well - "top secret, but make sure everyone knows about it"

admin

Hey BL - this is great; by the way, was invited to the Breville Aust] launch in Sydney today, but couldn't make it; if anyone's heard any new/surprising news, feel free to post up! A

Koffee_Kosmo

on 1305703196:

Hey BL - this is great; by the way, was invited to the Breville Aust] launch in Sydney today, but couldn't make it; if anyone's heard any new/surprising news, feel free to post up! A

Only a couple of new complete explanatory videos have been posted http://www.tested.com/ KK