Is the customer always right?

admin · May 2011

interesting [& thought-provoking] article from SMH - take a look: http://www.smh.com.au/entertainment/restaurants-and-bars/pour-diddums-8230-youll-get-your-coffee-how-we-like-it-20110520-1ewov.html, and post your comments!!

RichardM · May 2011

I don't understand the uproar. If he's arrogant, that's a different story, but Gloria Jeans make you put your own sugar in I'm pretty sure, as does my local takeaway cafe. I thought it was relatively normal??? I know some cafes ask for how many sugars, some provide two saches and a stirring spoon/stick etc.

Rider · May 2011

I'm with you Richard. I have sugar in my coffee, and I actually prefer to put it in myself. The unnamed lady not wanting to take the lid off and put sugar in as she is "rushing" out the door ::) Here's an idea - get your sorry a#$e there earlier...... She also has the option of asking for the lid unattached so that she can put the sugar in. But then again, she is in a rush...

RichardM · May 2011

on 1305966314:

I'm with you Richard. I have sugar in my coffee, and I actually prefer to put it in myself. The unnamed lady not wanting to take the lid off and put sugar in as she is "rushing" out the door ::) Here's an idea - get your sorry a#$e there earlier...... She also has the option of asking for the lid unattached so that she can put the sugar in. But then again, she is in a rush...

I look at it this way. There are only three things we need to live: Food, Drink, Air. If we can't take the time to have a nice drink while smelling the morning air, we need to reassess our lives (or get up earlier, as you said)

Koffee_Kosmo · May 2011

I have read that newspaper article The way I see it is The shop owner has the right to refuse service just as much as the customer has a choice to patronize or walk past The shop owner has a list of products to sell The patron can choose from that list e.g. If the shop does not stock soy milk or skim milk they cant make a coffee with it Its like me going to Coles & Woolworths and wanting a particular product & find out they dont stock it Do I protest?? Or do I go to an establishment that does On the point of the sugar If the sugar is part of the products they use Then its a matter of did the client ask for it to be added or not If the customer placed the order with specific instructions and it was not fulfilled then they are in the right If not don't expect the server to be a mind reader I have owned several retail establishments and speak from experience KK

beanflying · May 2011

The customer is right up to a point and when beyond that point NO!

askthecoffeeguy · May 2011

I had a customer tell me today that he dosent drink my coffee becauses it's too bitter / strong for him - so I said oh really, try this: and made him a 3/4 strength latte using a Brazil / Png blend - I then walked away and didn't even bother entering into further discussion with him as I knew the coffee was excellent, and if he didn't like it it was no fault of my own - and I wasn't about to lecture the guy on the ins and outs of coffee making (besides which I knew he wasn't a regular even though his wife is) I did however ask a staff member to follow up with him a few minutes later - and he described the coffee as, 'brilliant' It amazes me sometimes how folks can form an opinion without thorough investigation, or without stating their preferences properly in the first place - but the way I see it it's not my job to education them, just to make the best product I can, and if they like it, good, and if not I'll do my best to accommodate next time It's worth noting that most folks don't complain they just don't come back, but you can only act upon that which you are aware of - to my mind I would far rather endeavor to exceed a customer's expectations than presume to tell them right from wrong The customer is most certainly not always right, but unless you take the time to find out where they're coming from, its pretty hard to live up to their expectations P

DoubleRistretto · May 2011

on 1305966314:

I have sugar in my coffee, and I actually prefer to put it in myself.

I'm interested in the 'sugar' thing - obviously some say you should never have sugar (a good coffee should be sweet enough) but have also heard most italians drink their shots with a good spoon or two - I've never been to Italy but would be interested to know from those who have dR

Koffee_Kosmo · May 2011

on 1306022675:

I'm interested in the 'sugar' thing - obviously some say you should never have sugar (a good coffee should be sweet enough) but have also heard most italians drink their shots with a good spoon or two - I've never been to Italy but would be interested to know from those who have dR

It depends on the blend and the grind I have been told that the true Italian blend has a bit of Robusta in the mix and the grind is fine So they like strong tasting coffee and use sugar to take the edge off KK

o · May 2011

Aside the maybe possible exaduration of the journalist in it's potrail of the arrogance of the barista/owners. Make the bloody coffee how they want it, stop being so bloody minded. I personally think any milk or sugar is an affront to the beauty of the bean. But it's not for me to decide for you how to eat your food, how to drink your drink, or how you make love to your partner. I agree that if you have a philosophy that you feel integral to your company ethos, then it is your perogative to follow that. But if you have the ingredients available, and its a question of heat or adding sugar, be an adult and just make the drink how they want it. I promise it won't actually kill you. Exclusivity does not infer quality either.

hazchem · May 2011

This article kind of annoyed me. You don't have time to put in & stir sugar? That's BS. Just plain BS. If you don't want to add sugar because you believe your beverages are sweet enough & don't require it, then go right ahead. But don't give some lame excuse like you don't have time. If 2 baristas on 3 groups can't stir in sugar for customers you need new baristas. Further the research on the part of the journalist is pretty lame. While I have always heard bad things about the service (and coffee for that matter) at Kafenio in Cronulla, the quoted review from eatability about the 3/4 strong latte is nigh on 4 years old. Not really what I'd consider to be a current snapshot of any business. That said, I don't actually see what the problem is with making such a drink. Sounds pretty close to a 'magic' to me, and they're yummy! To the core of the question - is the customer always right? Yes, they are. Up to a point ... That point for me is when they really start to push what i consider to be acceptable quality limits for the food & drinks offered at the cafe I run. I have refused on two occasions recently to serve 30ml espressos. Customers were adamant that an espresso had to be 30ml in volume. I attempted to explain that this wasn't necessarily the case, and that ours were served a bit (quite a bit really) shorter than that as we believe they taste better at around 20ml or so. In both cases, I offered to make a 30ml espresso but advised I wasn't confident the drink would taste any good. One customer left, the other just accepted it and drank their espresso. The customer is always right. Most of the time. ;D

FreshCoffee2 · May 2011

Is the customer always right? Yes, of course they are not! And even then, depends on how they state their case. Sometimes they can be as right as rain, but if they come across in the manner of an a-hole, then they are invariably wrong regardless. No one is immune from having good manners and being polite. People that are polite, can get away with being wrong much more often than people who are right but are a holes about it.......... ;D As to journos writing stories about cafes, coffee and clients......has anyone here actually ever read in a newspaper anything about this stuff that wasnt some kind of a twisted round "beat up"? Wasnt there any "real news" to report on the day? Chiz to all, A.

admin · May 2011

fair point FC

on 1306022675:

I'm interested in the 'sugar' thing - obviously some say you should never have sugar (a good coffee should be sweet enough) but have also heard most italians drink their shots with a good spoon or two - I've never been to Italy but would be interested to know from those who have dR

actually, quite interested in the 'sugar in Italy' thing - was also under the impression that even though it's considered the home of espresso, most people in Italy add sugar to their espresso - does anyone who's travelled there have an opinion?

FreshCoffee2 · May 2011

honestly dont know what all the hoo har is ;D Some people just have a sweet tooth and want to sweeten their coffee. It doesnt mean the coffee was brewed badly and as I have said often enough, no amount of sugar will make a bad coffee drinkable. So if you like sugar you just like sugar! And who says you ***shouldnt*** put sugar in your brew? And who are those that presume to tell us what we can and cant do? Coffee - snobs in the derogatory sense of the word (snob) ? WRT the Italian way. As far as I am concerned their coffee style is enhanced by sugar and it lifts the coffee into a different dimension. Their style of blend is quite different to ours delivering a very different result in the cup. Try drinking their coffee without sugar and you quickly learn to take it. Their sugar portion sizes are much bigger than ours with atleast double the weight of sugar in each of their single portions than we have in ours. They are a different culture and they have their ways.....who are we to say they are wrong if that is the way their market has developed. Actually...you may be interested to know that they reckon we dont know what we are doing...shoe on the other foot syndrome ! ;D Rgdz, Attilio very first Crema site sponsor All that said.....I dont have sugar...but I do in Italy!

shape_shifter · May 2011

I found the following on HB, the historical aspect is probably the closest to the truth. A shot of espresso in Italy has the same market niche as a cup of coffee from an office carafe, diner or fast food place here, with the cost running between 60 cents to a dollar, depending on the neighbourhood and town. This means the blends, in general, don't use very good coffee, and that means it's not very sweet. In the post war years through the seventies, when Italian espresso culture took shape, this was even more the case. So most blends are designed for a packet of sugar (at least); and one basically should start at that point. Oh and to add my answer, yes the customer IS always right, it is their money and it is their taste buds, I know that if I owned a business (and yes I used to) I would prefer they sent their money my way than down the street!

FreshCoffee2 · May 2011

Excellent bit of research SS ! A.

shape_shifter · May 2011

Thank you A ;D they don't call me the research queen for nothing 8)

Rider · May 2011

on 1306050700:

This article kind of annoyed me.

on 1306137640:

honestly dont know what all the hoo har is ;D

I'm with Attilio here, The article started talking about a cafe that had put up a sign saying 'DIY sugar'. It then progressed/regressed into a giant lashing of cafe culture, drink style, evolution of espresso, precious genius...yada yada yada... I think the journo may have joined a few imaginary dots to flesh out the article.... ::) And as Attilio said elsewhere, smacks of slow new day... Not to say that Hazchem is wrong. Everywhere does it one way or the other, and this cafe has chosen to change tack. Good on them, that is where they want to be. Overall, they aren't saying you can't have sugar.

lars · May 2011

on 1306137640:

They are a different culture and they have their ways.....who are we to say they are wrong if that is the way their market has developed. Actually...you may be interested to know that they reckon we dont know what we are doing...shoe on the other foot syndrome ! ;D Rgdz, Attilio very first Crema site sponsor

I have travelled extensively in Italy and although it was some time ago [about 12 years] I'd be prepared to bet that few of us who like the quality 'new world' espresso that we enjoy here would be happy with the shots you'd get at the average cafe in Italy - low quality blends, lots of robusta, less emphasis on freshness, attitude [coffee is just a coffee], etc Lars

Lovey · May 2011

Presuming the lady in the quoted article who "Doesn't have time to put sugar in as she's running out the door" has a lid on her takeaway cup, does she expect the barista to put the lid on too? If so, this brings up a hygiene issue with the barista putting touching a part of the cup that the customer may drink from. "The customer is not always right, but they are always your customer." I quote I learned from some in-service course at work ;D.

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