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Tips for Robur E

oo
edited January 1970 in Grinders
Just got a RoburE today. Just having a few teething problems, just working out...
Firstly - Is it a reliably consistant doser (cause I found it dosed a little irregularly, though I put it down to my lack of experience with them)
Secondly - Is it better to leave the grind at a setting, and change the dose. Or change grind leaving dose, or both at the same time. This taking into consideration that we are a fairly high volume cafe, and lots of tinkering/taking time, really isn't that apropriate.
All of these things I know I can work out, but I'd love to hear some thoughts about using the RoburE specifically.
I know I can use the free dose option. But we are using it to cut down on wastage, and increase speed.
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  • Koffee_KosmoKoffee_Kosmo
    When I had an electronic grinder the best setting for me was manual  ;D Its best to grind a little more than a little less or you will need to give it a little burst to make up the shortfall In any case the time set to grind can be offset (plus or minus time) by the beans used and the humidity I now use a BNZ conical doser grinder as a preference and its equal is the Robur in the Mazzer range KK
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  • beanflyingbeanflying
    Not going to be a lot of direct use here as I run a K10 WBC doser but fitted with a timer. Listening and talking to users and on Twitter they get better after the burrs settle in for dose consistency. Static can be an issue with soft clumping but there is some chute mods to fix that if you think it an issue. May be of some use here with my Compak I change grind first for the beans/day etc. then adjust time second checking/tasting the resulting pours. This works best for me rather than changing time first. My only thoughts on this is that I use the timer for waste minimisation and consistency once I have a good pour. Interesting around Melbourne some going back to dosered grinders rather than E's
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  • oo
    I have just read about the burr thing too. I have been free dosing for about 3 years (which I greatly prefer). But we are finding that at the intense speed that we get up to in our rushes. We start to get a lot of wastage. And sore arms Regarging the RoberE - I may just have to wait a few days to let the burrs settle. But i'm also very curious about the second part of my question. I hope someone has had a lot of experience, and can give me a guiding hand in my aclimatising stage
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  • oo
    Thanks BF, I will take your morning set up as a guide
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  • hazchemhazchem
    on 1314094922:
    Just got a RoburE today. Just having a few teething problems, just working out... Firstly - Is it a reliably consistant doser (cause I found it dosed a little irregularly, though I put it down to my lack of experience with them) Secondly - Is it better to leave the grind at a setting, and change the dose. Or change grind leaving dose, or both at the same time. This taking into consideration that we are a fairly high volume cafe, and lots of tinkering/taking time, really isn't that apropriate. All of these things I know I can work out, but I'd love to hear some thoughts about using the RoburE specifically. I know I can use the free dose option. But we are using it to cut down on wastage, and increase speed.
    Firstly - no, not that reliably consistent at all. It is convenient & fast but even once the burrs settle the dose will vary. That said, it's kind of the best of a bad bunch really. Learn to eyeball the dose as best you can. If it seems to low/high even after you've distributed dump it out & start again. Secondly - it is never a good idea to set and forget anything on a grinder. You'll need to chase the grind all day, especially as the temperature in your work area & cafe overall changes. Be prepared to adjust your dose as well to achieve consistent shots. BUT only ever adjust one thing at a time, check your shots to see the effect and then decide what to adjust next. I find the free dose is even more unreliable than using the preset dosing buttons on the grinder. The only time I use that button is an extra purge of the grinder after I've made a grind adjustment. At least with the preset dose buttons, you'll get a consistent dose most of the time. Just don't expect it every single time. Have to say I am considering putting a doser grinder back on the bench now that I've put VST baskets into our portafilters.
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  • adminadmin
    Hi guys - no biggie, but since this is obviously about grinders, this is the appropriate thread, rather than 'have your say' A
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  • oo
    So. I'm generally dosing at around 2.85 - 3.10 for a single basket. And 3.80 - 4.05 for doubles. I'm sure everyone will have different times. But these have been excellent time ranges. And I've found the coffee to be quite amazing. I double tap the single basket once through the grinding process, and angle the handle up toward the chute so as to create a even pile. Then double tap on the bench before tamping. For the double I do the same. But double tap the handle three time before angling up toward the chute, then double tap etc. I find this creates excellent distribution in the basket. Which results in a lovely even extraction. The RoburE, I fully concede and advise. Is NOT a 100% reliably consistent doser. But my word it's a great grinder. And seriously can improve your coffee. So much ability to control your shots (once you get the hang of the beast). And allows you to make your coffee taste almost how you always wished and knew you could. But didn't till you got one Gush ;D ;D ;D
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  • beanflyingbeanflying
    Sounds like your a happy user :) Similar variations on time to what I need on my K10 for bean changes. Did you find the times came down and got more consistent initially after a few kg of bean?
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  • oo
    Definitely more consistent. And the dose times went down a little too. About 0.1. If you are an absolute perfectionist. I wouldn't own this machine per se. As the timed function would frustrate you. But for a super busy cafe like the one I work in. It's a gift from some religious figurehead
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  • mycuppamycuppa
    As hazchem noted, it's almost impossible to get a stable and happy state with grinders. Chasing is the right word. The variability of your adjustments are related to 3 factors - 1. Stability of your environment (ambient temps, elevated workloads, etc.), 2. Your ability to precisely replicate your technique when applying adjustments, dosing, tamping and including shot extraction. 3. An often overlooked consideration.........the state and consistency of your beans from pack to pack, e.g. freshness, roast level, blend composition, etc. #1 and #2 you are more aware and able to compensate or establish some control guides. #3 is something you need to look at carefully - check the batch dates on your packs, compare roast levels between packs and look at the effect of when a newly opened pack of beans are tipped into the hopper. A large cafe we supply opens up at least 6x 1kg packs each morning before they start - just like a nice bottle of red. All these will play havoc with precise timed grinders.
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  • beanflyingbeanflying
    The E thing over a doser I still haven't decided what I prefer to use but for waste minimisation and good (not great) consistency when under the pump they have got to be a good thing. Still plenty of top places in Melbourne have dropped them and gone to dosered again. I am still looking at a second large grinder this side of Christmas and tossing up another K10 doser or either the M7E or K10 electronic as my next one but I am still loving my separate timer and K10 option currently  ???
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  • oo
    I think people wil disagree with this. But the k10 is a piece of crap. The top part which is both grind adjuster and bean chamber. Heats up to some fairly reticules temps. I would never own this grinder. I've used one for over a year. And I strongly suggest not to buy one. If you run a 4kg max venue...ok. Otherwise, buy a robur, or bnz
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  • Brett HBrett H
    on 1315407815:
    I think people wil disagree with this. But the k10 is a piece of crap. The top part which is both grind adjuster and bean chamber. Heats up to some fairly reticules temps. I would never own this grinder. I've used one for over a year. And I strongly suggest not to buy one. If you run a 4kg max venue...ok. Otherwise, buy a robur, or bnz
    Wow! That's a strong opinion.  I remember reading that the K3 was a wonderful grinder for the home user and a huge step up from the Rocky.  I'm glad I went and looked at one because the movement in the collar compared to the Rocky was huge.  It also seemed very plastic-y.  I needless to say bought another Rocky but I'm not qualified to comment on the K3 given my assessment of it was only cursory and fleeting.  You having lived with one are far more qualified however, could it be that you had a dud unit?  The k10 fresh is of course one of those grinders in my 'special' dreams... I am not a likely consumer.
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  • beanflyingbeanflying
    In a flat out commercial environment might tend to agree with you but for most commercial environments the K10 is streets in front of most other grinders that were used until only a few short years ago. 'crap' is way to over the top and not fair or reasonable comment at all. Out of interest I have comfortably run 8kg+ out of my K10 with no real heating issues. BNZ I haven't used but there is a few others here that have them and like them. As to home use it is totally a non issue it's biggest downfall (doser version) is the grind retention between the burrs and the doser (8-10g). This can be reduced with a fairly simple mod.
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  • coffeehorsecoffeehorse
    I also think that's a little harsh - the K10 Conic does have some 'baking' issues in very high volume environments, but it's rare that a cafe will experience the kind of rush that will cause a K10 WBC spec grinder to bake coffee. After a lot of time with a pair of BNZ MD-74s, on a good day I can reliably dose a portafilter to 0.1/0.2g, and when I'm not trying I'm usually around 0.4g, which is about the variance I experience with a Robur-E. Who's gone back to the Robur-D in melbourne? My main tip for the Robur-E would be practicing dosing by weight rather than time, and that it's possible the topup button is more accurate than the single dose/double dose button. @hazchem will probably let you know how much he hated the BNZ in a caff situation, and how the E dumps all over it  8)
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  • Koffee_KosmoKoffee_Kosmo
    My BNZ MD 74 is just fine However its underutilized at home when all it gets is 4 or so uses per day  :o KK
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  • beanflyingbeanflying
    Sipping on a K10 ground coffee this morning at work. Today's load of 6-8 coffees won't create any problems here I expect either  ;)
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