Londinium I Lever Espresso Machine

UNM · March 2013

on 1362197893:

Lacehim brings the Achille, KK the Strega and AM the Cremina and we have ourselves a good old fashioned lever-off!

I visualised you all gathered together pulling each others levers until everyone is satisfied and all have savoured each others shots. Not sure that I should thank you for that mental image Kelsey.

ash · March 2013

on 1362207369:

I visualised you all gathered together pulling each others levers until everyone is satisfied and all have savoured each others shots. Not sure that I should thank you for that mental image Kelsey.

Not even going there.... >:D It would be awesome to have all of these levers in the one place to try out though, may have to see how transportable mine is first though!!! Pictures will be had, I plan on photographing everything, from the first sight of the box until it is up and functioning on my bench and the first shot is pulled!

It's times like these I wish Customs could do their maths thing on a weekend as well. So close yet so far to my machine..... Back to the Lusso, time for some Yirg :coffee2:

Koffee_Kosmo · March 2013

on 1362197893:

Lacehim brings the Achille, KK the Strega and AM the Cremina and we have ourselves a good old fashioned lever-off!

There are two ways this can be done The Brisbane contingent can do a holiday bus trip to Townville Or one trip to Brisbane by ash - I can donate some cash to help with fuel costs KK

ash · March 2013

Well I'd be willing to travel to Brisbane, but it probably wouldn't happen until October for me, the way work is going for me at the moment. Definately something to keep in mind and think about some more. I may be able to tie it in with another trip I'm planning for around that time anyway

ash · March 2013

Well it's arrived! :coffee2: My Machine left the UK on February 26, arrived in Australia on March 01 then promptly sat and waited for Customs to do their thing. Finally it was released on March 07 and a delivery was attempted on March 13. Unfortunately I was overseas at the time, so I went to the local DHL agents and picked it up this morning. The GST and customs and everything else I had to pay was $299.85. A lot less than what I was budgeting for, as I was thinking it was going to be around $450.00. Overall the machine arrived safe, the only bit of damage being a slight ding in the drip tray, which I think is from the group handles were boxed underneath the group. Included in the box are two group handles, a single spout and single basket and a double spout and double basket. Both baskets are ridge types. There is also a water filter cartridge that Reiss recommends for the tank, and of course the instructions. I took my time unpackaging everything, and removing all the protective coatings on the steel. It's not as physically imposing as I thought it might be. It's actually quite compact, with the depth of the thing being the most blatant dimension. After I filled up the tank I switched it on and the vibe pump began filling the boiler. Exactly as the manual says, it stopped filling and an alarm sounded. This is the element protection circuit kicking in. So I followed the instructions in th manual and switched it off for five seconds then switched it on to continue filling. Once it was full it stated heating up. Up to pressure in under four minutes. Bled off the false pressure, it pumped in some more water and the pressure up again. Passed some water through the group as per instructions for a fast heat to temp for the goup and then ground some coffee. At the moment I am finishing of some Yirgacheffe from my local roaster (Coffee Dominion) here in Townsville. It's well past it's peak flavour, but still quite tasty

As can be expected with a totally new machine that is significantly different to my little Ponte Vecchio Lusso, my first shot was a gusher. Tightened up the grind some more and another gusher, not quite as bad this time. Third time lucky, I got the grind into an acceptable ball park, though I think I could go slightly finer still. This time I got a drinkable shot. Talk about clarity of flavour. WOW!!! :coffee2: Put it this way, when I had the Giotto I though I was getting good flavours and nice distinction. With the PV I thought I had a more enjoyable cup with the same qualities as the Giotto, but this just in another league when it comes to bringing out the flavours of the bean. The Yirg was an absolute flavour bomb going off in my mouth. Time to go and try some more shots, I'm going to be bouncing around on caffeine today I think :coffee2:

hiphipharar · March 2013

Good report. Glad you didn't have any of the transport damage dramas others have reported. It has piqued my interest in the L1 again

Bern · March 2013

Nice one Ash. Glad it arrived safely and has exceeded your expectations. Now I wants one.

ash · March 2013

From what Reiss has said on his blog, he's changing the foam from the low density stuff that was used in my packaging to a higher density foam. Should mean less chance of damage again. It'll also mean less pieces of foam breaking off when you unpack it. Installing the top of the group was a breeze, and does allow you to have a look at the working bits before installing. Just make sure you watch the video Reiss has done about the installation of the group and you wont go wrong. I should also mention that the machine I have is configured to accept a plumbed in connection as well as the tank option on which it operating at the moment. The cost including shipping was

Ros · March 2013

Looks fantastic, I bet it tastes better, Can't wait till the day I can order mine, hoping I will have enough moola to make an order in October/Nov

It's definitely represents great value regardless of an Imported machine direct from The manufacturer which does not bother me in the slightest

Ol Grumpy · March 2013

Congrats Ash, Now we've had a few brave 'icebreakers' , like yourself, pave the way we may well see a few more people have the confidence to 'order direct'... Not that I wish any ill- will at all to current regional suppliers, but my own gut feeling is that more and more we will see a drastic change in retailing in this country and I can see more and more direct-manufacturing-customer models becoming more and more prevalent/popular in the marketplace... But who cares about that... Enjoy your new machine... Cheers!

derrilex · March 2013

on 1363578211:

The cost including shipping was

Koffee_Kosmo · March 2013

on 1363596052:

Hmmm, a grand cheaper than a strega. But what about product support ?

No it's not its about $600 cheaper than the Strega with import GST and transport Thats if the same rules apply and depending on the customs officer and any changes to insurance if claims are made the insurance goes up KK

Beanz · March 2013

on 1363575099:

the group handles were boxed underneath the group. Included in the box are two group handles, a single spout and single basket and a double spout and double basket. Both baskets are ridge types. :

Hi Ash I note you mention single and double handles and baskets. I understood the Londinium only came with a double but with an option of ordering a bottomless. Is the single an option or has the standard offering changed recently ? I cannot see the single mentioned on the web site

derrilex · March 2013

on 1363600579:

No it's not its about $600 cheaper than the Strega with import GST and transport Thats if the same rules apply and depending on the customs officer and any changes to insurance if claims are made the insurance goes up KK

Last price I got from Chris was 3.8k for full bore retail

conikal · March 2013

on 1363596052:

Hmmm, a grand cheaper than a strega. But what about product support ?

Well .. comparing like for like...... ...... IF you bought the Strega the same way,..direct import from the UK,.. the Strega actually ends up at Au$1900 + Tax's landed cost. ( $2200 total ??) So the Strega would be a fair bit cheaper than the L1!

Koffee_Kosmo · March 2013

on 1363602042:

Last price I got from Chris was 3.8k for full bore retail

I thought it was $3300 KK

Ol Grumpy · March 2013

Yes, how we 'value' lots of things will need to be reviewed... We've been overcharged here in Oz for so many things and on so many levels....

derrilex · March 2013

on 1363604223:

I thought it was $3300 KK

I guess I'll find out soon enough :D

ash · March 2013

Beanz, The machine came with the single spout pf and single basket, double spout pf and double basket as part of of the machine purchase. I bought a naked pf when I purchased the machine as well, and it came with a double basket. I've also purchased a 15gm VST basket to try once I get a handle on what I'm doing with this machine. For the next few weeks I intend to use the double baskets that came with the machine and the naked pf. I prefer a naked pf for a couple of reasons. One, it helps me get my technique better, as I can see the results of channelling or other problems with my tamping. I think this helps me getter better shots quicker. Two, I just love the sight of espresso coming from the pf direct to the cup! :coffee2: My first couple of shots today had horrific channelling, which was evidenced by what was coming from the basket and confirmed when I looked at the puck after the extraction. I wasn't too worried as I was still dialling in my grinder at that point. This afternoon I got to a nice spot with the grinder and tamp technique and was able to get some nice pours. Taste was pretty damn good as well ;D For those who are curious, at this point in time I'm using the WDT method to aid in consistancy. However; I will be experimenting with my roast profiles over the coming weeks, as what I was doing previously (with my roasts) doesn't taste like I am doing them justice with this machine. In tht respect the PV Lusso is a much more forgiving machine. The Londinium I will highlight any taste characteristics from my roasts amazingly well I think, but I'll reserve my judgement on that until a few weeks and different beans have been tried. I do know that the Yirg I had this afternoon had the same flavour bomb in my mouth as a syphon brewed Yirg that I had a few months ago. Just more intense, as I think espresso should be compared to a syphon brew. It's something I hadn't been able to get from either the Giotto that I used to own or the PV. They could get close to the clarity of a syphon brew, but no cigar. Both of these machines give a more 'rounded' taste compared to the Londinium I. You could almost think of the Londinium I as giving the flavours/taste a scapel edge that just comes through and slams into your senses. It will highlight any deficiencies with my roasting I'm thinking. Which is kinda scary in a good way! ???

Lacehim · March 2013

Ash, NICE MATE! I might have to come visit one day!

on 1363575099:

Bled off the false pressure, it pumped in some more water and the pressure up again.

Doesn't the L1 have an antivac? You shouldn't have to bleed off any false pressure like the lusso (not that I had to do that either after my mod

) Regards

on 1363607297:

In tht respect the PV Lusso is a much more forgiving machine.

The lusso was a great machine. It was a lot more forgiving with tamping too. I had to totally relearn my technique with I got my Achilles. I'm still roasting the same, to just on 2ndC and I've found lighter roasts from some of the local roasters (Clandestino's for example) need a finer grind than my own beans from my KKTO. It will be great to compare these two machines too. They use the same group, but the Achilles has a second spring. Nice purchase though. Even though I have a lovely machine already (I was too impatient) I still eagerly await new on here to see how great these machine are turning out.

ash · March 2013

Just followed the initial fill instructions in the book, I'll see tomorrow morning if I have to do it again. Mind you, after the Lusso, it doesn't really worry me that much. A short blast of steam isn't to much of an issue for me

The regular morning routine will be up for examination tomorrow: wake up, fire up the machine, morning ablutions, coffee.... I'll report back on how it goes!

ash · March 2013

Just reporting that the machine does indeed have an anti-vac valve. Fired it up this morning when I got up and made an acceptable espresso 35 mins later with no need to bleed off any false pressure. I purposely did not do the quick group heat cycle, ie. flushing water through the group, just to see what it was like after my morning routine. Very happy with it's performance this morning. :coffee2: I'll be trying some Java Ijein(sp?) Sundried that I roasted just over two weeks ago this afternoon, and I'll try and post some pics of the extraction and maybe get around to doing a dodgy vid of it as well. However there are plenty of vids on you tube of this machine doing its thing, so my efforts may be a bit redundant. I may even try out the steaming side of things with the two hole tip that I bought, instead of the stock four hole tip.

FreshCoffee2 · March 2013

I think there may be cause for a couple of clarifications. E61 machines are known to produce heavier brews, effectively bringing out whetever body is in the grinds being used. That is their style. Its a little difficult to compare a PVL (I have one) with other machines using full size commercial filters, because they dont hold the same amount of grinds...so to compare, one would have to adjust the volume of liquid put through, to account for the difference in weight of grinds as compared to machines using commercial size filters. "Full size" lever machines have their own style, and that is what they do! There are many facets to comparing items of equipment to one another and the black coffee they can produce is only one of them especially in this market where most people drink milks. Steamability, ease of use & the logistics of working around a machine, serviceability etc are other legitimate points to compare, equally important to the standard of coffee, and may differ according to individual owners. It would therefore probably be of greater benefit to compare a lever machine with a similar (or atleast, similar size, pitched at the same market) lever machine, and not cause an unwarranted avalanche of people crossing their favourite electromechanical machine off the list and replacing it with a lever, because someone said the resulting coffee has "more clarity". E61 machines asa group produce "more body"..... They are different animals, clients need to decide what it is they are looking for in the equipment, and the ability to visit a working showroom and get a demonstration is not a bad thing if they have no prior experience with equipment at this end of the home market. People with electromechanical machines who also roast their own coffee, can also roast and blend their coffee to give "more clarity" in their machine. Hope that helps.

ash · March 2013

E61 machines are known to produce heavier brews, effectively bringing out whetever body is in the grinds being used. That is their style.

Fair enough, and my memory of the coffee's I was getting from my Giotto are fading fast admittedly :pan And I do take on board your points re 'body' and 'clarity' and the differences between the styles of the machines. I suppose clarity is something I've been chasing (instinctively I guess) in my coffees more so than body, otherwise I would have stuck with the Giotto. Then again I am one of those strange Australian coffee drinkers who tends to prefer black coffee over its milky cousin, don't know if thats got anything to do with it! ;D Perhaps I should have said more clarity than what I have previously experienced from a lever? This is now my third home lever machine, I've previously had a La Pavoni Profesional as well as my PVL so this machine is new again in that it has the commercial size group instead of a small group. The idea of comparing similar machines is something I'd like to do if my fellow lever owners and I can organise it later in the year. I know I would find it quite interesting to taste the same bean from different machines of the same class. If it gets organised, it would be awesome. Especially if a few industry types came along to share their thoughts on each machine. As an aside, I dropped the dose down this evening to something closer to what I used on the PVL and the attached pics are the result. I think I'm starting to get my tamp and distribution on a 58mm group right again, and the coffee tasted nice to boot!

Lacehim · March 2013

on 1363686612:

and the coffee tasted nice to boot!

That's the most important bit. I still need to work on my tamp, consistency is an issue, but that's life when your the only coffee drinker and the beans change every bag. One day I think I'll roast up a kg and invite all the neighbours around for a sample.

It's a great adventure though isn't it!

ash · March 2013

Okay, after just under a week of ownership, a couple of things I've found. This machine is finicky about distribution, compared to what I was used to on the PV or the Giotto. I'm just sticking with Reiss' recommended dose in the stock double basket of 15.8gm (or close to) and have used older beans (4 weeks post roast) and 4-5 day old beans. I'm putting this down to my weak technique with a 58mm group and have gotten around it by using an unfolded paperclip to stir up the grounds a little and get a more even distribution after I've dosed. I've got to try a couple more things which will hopefully improve my coffee. I haven't tried up dosing yet, as what I've seen so far would indicate that any more than 17gm in the stock double basket would have the coffee pressing right against the dispersion screen tightly. The couple of lower dosed efforts so far have been very tasty, and I may find myself going towards a lower dose more consistently in the future. :coffee2: Steaming, as you would expect on a machine at this price range, is impressive so far. I haven't really smashed the steam side of things yet however, so that may take a little longer to get a grip on. The first bit of milk I did came up beautifully, and had that nice sweet taste when I did some dodgy milk art. I wouldn't call what I produced a latte, more a weak flat white with some foam on top... :pan

Kelsey · March 2013

The Lusso is definitely more forgiving on dose and tamp. I found it a breeze to pull shots on the first time I tried it at Lacehim's. However when Lacehim received his Achille, he initially had some issues getting a top-notch brew - in my visit in those first few days I was able to produce somewhat better results, but only because my own 58mm group had already gotten me into good dose and tamping habits. So keep at it - none of us get it right all the time, but it definitely gets easier!!

UNM · April 2013

Someone kindly pointed me at a <a href=http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-equipment-extreme-machines-3000/34493-londinium-l1-luxe-edition-lets-have-look.html#post496567>; link to a review of the londinium L1 elsewhere.</a> Unfortunately, having been banned from that site (no reason given) I cannot see the pictures. Despite the review appearing to me as a contrived negative review, masquerading as a balanced piece, negative aspects do sound genuine and deserving of attention. In fact, someone deliberately searching for faults can be infinitely more helpful, than someone writing a 'puff piece'. So, I await the londinium response with interest and can only hope some kind soul posts pictures where they are publicly viewable. I would note that deflection of panels due to nuts tightening has less to do with torque than with the mating faces themselves. I have seen this on other high end machines and find it detracts from the appearance. If user switches are getting to 75 degrees and water is leaking on electrical components, those concerns really need to be addressed.

UNM · April 2013

Oh another thing I didn't mention. If I had a commercial interest in trashing a new machines reputation, I might consider buying one of the machines, loosen a few bits here and there, overtighten others, maladjust it, scratch it up a bit and lend to someone for an independent review. Just saying. Obviously no ethical business would do such a thing.

Koffee_Kosmo · April 2013

on 1365205548:

Oh another thing I didn't mention. If I had a commercial interest in trashing a new machines reputation, I might consider buying one of the machines, loosen a few bits here and there, overtighten others, maladjust it, scratch it up a bit and lend to someone for an independent review. Just saying. Obviously no ethical business would do such a thing.

Now now settle down We don't really need to get into conspiracy theories There have also been equally great reviews of the L1 - a lot more are favourable on the WWW KK

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