I-Coffee Roaster, Behmor or Baby Roaster FZ-RR-700?

lmz · February 2014

Thanks Jeff, beans used are Brazil Fazenda Laranjal - Yellow Bourbon and it is not the image but you are very kind

KK pm sent

shape_shifter · February 2014

LMZ I'll get sid to come in here and maybe offer some advice, she's had hers for at least a year and loves it.

lmz · February 2014

thanks SS, cannot wait to meet and hear from Sid

sidoney · February 2014

On checking, I've had it for two years now.

Mine has a motor. I would not say I'm an expert and I don't have any experience with other roasters so I cannot compare. I did have some "chuck out" roasts when learning - actually, I sent them to work with my husband because the people there had no idea of what good coffee actually was and so they all loved them. I aim for first crack at ten minutes and for second crack to start at about fifteen. That is what I read on someone's discussion about using it and have been following that ever since. I had to switch burners around a bit until I worked out a method that worked for me. Some people use those small portable ones with the butane bottles. I use the stove. At first I used a midsize burner and an aluminium foil baffle to concentrate the heat, which I needed to have it hot enough. These days, I get it to first crack on the wok burner to get the timing right and then switch it to a smaller one when first crack is established to coast through a bit more, as I read that first crack is exothermic and so you don't need to use as much heat during it, and also not after it, you can let the beans go into second crack at a lower temperature. I do need to keep some heat on into second crack but it's much less. Certainly to get those target times you need to get the heat down once first crack is happening but it's best to wait until it's rolling so it doesn't stall. Drop the heat too soon and it will tend to stall and that's not too great. You can turn the heat up again and it goes but it's not as good. It *is* pretty responsive to heat input changes. What works for me is to have it fairly hot until smoke starts coming, then back it off a bit, then let it get into rolling first crack, then take it to a slower heat so it doesn't gallop into second crack too soon. Depending on the bean and the planned extraction method I usually finish it a bit before second crack, at the first snaps of second crack, or when it's got a little more into second crack. With the time targets I mentioned above. I do give it a visual check as it goes, generally in the period after first crack, but when learning I was doing it more often. I rely on ear a lot more now, but as it's getting close, I'll tip a few beans into the bowl I'm putting them into, and decide whether to stop then or to go a bit longer. Even if I do that a few times that's OK because it's just a mix of flavour profiles from lighter to darker and I don't mind that. Obviously I'm doing that after a check into the drum shows that they are pretty close to being ready. You need a decent directed light to do that. Different beans will sound different. Some will crack louder or quieter, they may go all around the same time or others will crack over a longer time period. First crack is louder and some have a very subtle second crack. It's very seat-of-the-pants and I'm probably not doing it to the absolute optimum but I've been enjoying what I've been drinking and others enjoy it too so something is going right. You won't be expecting as even a roast as you would get in say a convection roaster. If I post photos I get comments about unevenness and also about divots in the beans but I don't worry too much about that these days, it's kind of a function of the fact that some beans will end up contacting the copper more than others, even with shaking. Some varieties will tend to roast more evenly and some less so. The unwashed Africans simply will not roast evenly for me. But, generally my beans tend to be more even than the photos you have been showing. So, something to work on. I don't shake all that often and sometimes I forget for a few minutes, like if I'm doing something else at the time. When I do, I use a sort of figure eight motion, to try to get it all mixed up. I try to do it at least every couple of minutes. Probably that's not optimum either but it's working OK. I've read every minute is good but that means I can't easily go and load the dishwasher or whatever while roasting. Whether to roast different beans together or separately, for me, depends on the bean and what I want out of it. If they are similar in size and hardness I'll do it more together if I'm blending. Lately though I tend to roast different beans separately. But most recently I'm just grabbing roasting time windows when I can and doing single roasts of SO beans like Yirgacheffe and PNG Kimel, instead of roasting greater numbers of types of beans separately. Like I said, I'm not an expert and also I can get a bit distracted, but it's good enough for me and for the people that I've given coffee to.

The photo below was from October last year. I was experimenting with roasting a bit lighter than I'd mostly done in the past. I got a bit distracted on one of them (I often multi-task when roasting and check in while doing other things, and/or keep an ear on it) and it got a bit darker than intended but it tasted OK. In no particular order, there are Brazilian, Honduran, Ethiopian and Sumatran beans in the photo.

I hope my post helps. I'll answer any questions you have of me, with the disclaimer that I'm only someone who enjoys a bit of home coffee roasting and drinking.

lmz · February 2014

Thanks Sid, your post is very helpful. You guys (ladies) are so much better than us for multi-tasking...as you demonstrated. :laugh: I will try to increase time to second roast by switching to a slower burner on my stove as suggested. I am struggling with the even roast but will keep trying the shaking. I found this post from CS about a hose clamp you can fit onto the arm to get a very even roast without bay need for shaking. Any experience anyone? Here is the content: Originally Posted by stucci I have done a similar mod, not requiring to split the drum. You need to get a 17-32mm hose clamp from the hardware. Go to the plumbing section and make sure it is 316 band and housing, the ones in the irrigation section have a steel body and screw. Wind down the clamp so that it is a tight fit on the roaster inner spindle. Then it is a matter of gently forcing the clamp over the spindle and down into the centre of the drum. If it is too tight then loosen the clamp, too loose then tighten the clamp. I find that once it is in the right position (centre of the drum) you can still get a small spanner in there and tighten the clamp a little more so it doesnt spin on the shaft. Once done then all you need to do is straighten out the excess band (needle nose pliers) so that it almost touches the inside of the drum. Costs less than $5, takes about 10 minutes, easily removed, and most important all stainless steel. Simon A great idea for which I modified the installation. On the handle end I loosened the socket screw so I could pull the handle and the gear off the shaft. Then undid the two small screws on the same end holding the copper drum to the shaft. The shaft then comes out of the other end easily allowing me to easily attach 2 hose clamps using a screwdriver instead of fiddling in a very confined space with a small spanner. I used 8/22 clamps as that is what I had. I made sure that the tails on the clamps would fit through the bean loading hole ( bent them until they would ) and then refitted the shaft and handle. Bent the tails on the clamps out with pointy nosed pliers out so they almost touched the outside of the drum. Result, a very even roast with no shaking. I'm almost sure after doing a couple of roasts that the profiles are different but I will have to do more roasts to be certain, I previously thought that the shaking of the drum was part of the back to the roots charm of this roaster, but after this 5 minute mod it won't be happening again. John

sidoney · February 2014

I've never tried that but the best way to find out about something is to give it a go.

Sounds pretty easy to set up, and reversible.

lmz · February 2014

I have done the mods today on the stirrer arm by adding 2 Stainless Steel 316 grade hose clamps in the middle section of the shaft. I will report on how this impact on the roast.... Maybe I will not have to shake anymore and can (with reason) attend a few small side jobs at the same time like Sidoney

mycuppa · February 2014

LMZ, I do not know how to use the Baby Roaster, but I can share some basic principles (or rules) about coffee roasting in general. 1. Keep thermal momentum moving - if you can't get any indication of the temperature on you apparatus, you need to ensure that heat is always being applied. Some home roasting equipment lack the ability to leverage thermal mass, conduction, radiant or other, etc. so I would imagine it is vitally important to keep heat applied so that your rate of rise in temp does not stall or flat-line. 2. Monitor, Log, Review, Optimize I don't follow any home roasting equipment threads, so I don't know if anyone has considered trying to either install or place a thermocouple near the heat source or at some stationary point on the Baby Roaster where heat can be measured. This would allow you to monitor, log and review your techniques more accurately and subsequently arrive at ideas for improvements or changes with greater precision. As an example - say you place a TC at the same fixed point of heat source for each roast and you then use this method as a control parameter for determining how much heat to apply at each stage of a roast profile. It's so that you can repeat more consistently or at least have greater confidence that you are running a batch with more control. Looking at a flame is very difficult. 3. Optimal Batch time and Roast Development There are targets that people use as guides - you need these as foundations. 15 minute roast duration is something to start with, but it's not the holy grail that everyone seems to worship. Optimal roast duration is different based upon many variables - heat transfer method, efficiency, rate of rise, etc. Sure, there are some very natural transitions that occur during roasting that have proven to "transpire" in given time-frames, but these are just guides and someone roasting on a 60kg roaster will experience different conditions than a small batch home roasting system. It is possible to engineer your systems to meet these sort of targets, but I stress very clearly - don't get hung up on always trying to achieve that mythical 15 min roast time. It could be that 12 mins might produce something better for you and your systems. Always experiment. Roast Development Time (RDT) is also another highly contentious issue. Old school theories have this in the 3 - 5 mins range, but I tend to think those sort of numbers are more suitable to larger, commercial systems that have super-precise control over airflow and heat transfer. RDT depends upon the way in which your systems work. With higher ratios of conduction used as the primary thermal transfer method, it can be possible to extend RDT's to longer periods with lower risks of stalled Rate of Rise (ROR's) if you say compared this to a method that empliys higher convection (air) as primary heat transfer. Understanding how your device behaves in that critical RDT zone is the key to improved results. Shorter/faster RDT's can yield some interesting results so long as earlier stages of the roast have been executed correctly. What I'm trying to point out here is......don't be afraid to have a 2min RTD. The important thing to remember is keep experimenting until you find that a change has resulted in positive improvements - then keep running in that direction. Logs, reviews (cupping) and ideas are what creates a good roast - unfortunately, technical science plays a lesser role.

Lwowiak · February 2014

Jeff, Thank you for posting so much information. Your contributions here are always eagerly read by many. LMZ, I do not have anywhere near the roasting experience that Jeff does, but can add some helpful (hopefully) advice. I use a camping stove and the butane canisters. I find this provides an excellent heat source that is easily adjustable. The butane provides a very concentrated and hot flame. Roast away from the wind or any drafts. I roast in the garage, and ensure the environment is ventilated. Roasting in the evenings allows me better control of the heat source. The flame is more visible and you can see any minute adjustments to the heat source. I start off with a 3/4 flame, and then slightly reduce it at the first puff of smoke (3-4 minutes). Heat is applied constantly until first crack. Gradually reduce the heat as first crack gets under way, and lower the flame to a low setting. Keep the heat constant and second crack should start in 3-4 minutes. If it does not, then increase the heat. Do not tip at the first snaps of second crack, but let the roast continue for anywhere between 15- 60 seconds. IF you get a very vigorous second crack, then tip straight away, as the roast will get away from you very quickly. Sometimes I turn off the heat as second crack starts and allow the drum to keep turning. this usually helps to even out the roast. About 30 -45 seconds later I tip out the beans. The trick is to keep trying with the same bean (Brazil is a good one to learn on) and try different approaches. You can reduce the intensity of the flame to control the heat between first and second crack; so that second starts 2 minutes, 3 minutes or 4 minutes after first. Try each roast and see which result appeals to you. If you extend the time between first and second to more than 5 or 6 minutes, you usually end up with a flat result. It depends on the bean though, as harder beans will take longer to roast in this unit. I shake every minute or so, and smell the roast as it progresses. Open up the unit and inspect the roast (tip out a couple of beans and give them a crunch) at least once or twice after first crack. If they taste sour and acidic, keep roasting. For espresso you want to reach second crack. Don't be afraid to roast a little darker, as this unit will still keep some of the flavours with a dark roast. If you get a lot of divots then you need to shake the drum more often. Cool the beans as rapidly as you can. Don't get frustrated, just keep trying, it is only 200g at a time. I find control of the flame to be the most crucial aspect to master. 12 minute roasts yield beautiful results. Harder beans will take longer. The addition of the stirrer unit helps even out the roast for dense beans. When I roast a hard bean, I maintain 3/4 heat all the way to first crack, ensuring that I shake every minute. This ensures an even roast. I do not like to walk away from an open flame, and once first crack has started, I always pay close attention to ensure the roast is progressing as it should. If the ambient temp is low, you may have to increase the heat. For my lever machine, I like all the roasts to reach second crack as a bare minimum. I normally tip when they are popping and have even taken the roasts to darker levels. It all depends on the type of bean. Brazil and Indonesian beans are stopped on the cusp or just into second crack. Others are roasted longer. Taste is very personal. First crack at 71/2 to 9 minutes is usual, do not be afraid of short roasts, as this is only a small batch. Experiment with a lower heat before first crack (say 10 minutes), but then only slightly reduce the heat so that second is finished 2-3 minutes later. This works well for Indo and Brazil. All the best!

lmz · February 2014

Thanks Jeff for very informative post. Very good of you to share your knowledge. Much appreciated Lwowiak for posting what works for you as well. I think you right and I will keep trying with the same beans for a while... I also agree as I gain more experience controlling the heat is the key which means I will keep logging my roast profiles in my little notebook. Here is my first roast after the stirrer arm mod. It does improve how even the beans look.... 150g Costa Rica green Beans 1st crack: 9.30min 2nd crack: 13.50min Roast: 14.15min

GaryatGala · February 2014

Great to see of your progress Laurent. The last pic you displayed looks like the best so far. :thumb: Let us know how your first two roast batches tasted. If you dont like them as espresso based coffee, then try a filtered coffee and compare. As shown on my video, medium heat at the start for the drying phase, then higher to medium to high heat, then anticipate to slow down the heat just before first crack, then cruise til second. Those guys are right. The roasts taste great even taken right into second crack. My preference is still just on the cusp of second as I like to experience both roast and origin characters for balance. Keep trying Laurent. Certainly do think about building a KKTO too. You never know, when your friends enjoy your coffee, you may wish to roast for them so that they can pay for your coffee habit, that's where the KKTO and coretto comes in with their bigger batch sizes. They are a great roaster since I also have them both together with the coretto. :thumb:

Lwowiak · February 2014

Make sure you use at least 200g green bean weight. I have gone as high as 230g, but not with beans that produce a lot of chaff. Any less than 200g (green bean) will not produce an even result.

lmz · February 2014

Baby Roaster Costa Rica today using some of your previous suggestions No shaking due to stirrer arm mods 200g green 1st crack 10.45 2nd crack 15.20 Roast time 15.45 I feel that heat control before 1st crack is key and you were right 200g seems to improve evenness Come on Gary some encouragement please (he is a tough judge!)

Laurent

Koffee_Kosmo · February 2014

Looking lots better than the previous attempts :thumb: KK

GaryatGala · February 2014

??? I felt my ears burnin.. Oh hey, you know, better to tell it like it is rather than be too nice and say yeah sure that'll do. You may know the song that goes..." You gotta be cruel to be kind, in the the right measure, cruel to be kind, it's a very good sign etc etc" It's a 70,s or 80,s song, i think.. Judging by the looks, it is the best roast thus far Laurent, well done. :thumb: The proof in the pudding is how it tastes, rather than how it looks. As I mentioned in an earlier post, have you tasted the first two roasts? How did you like the taste? 200 gm is always the recommended load, you can err less or more but not much more or much less. Next roast, try and lessen the gap between first and second. Add slightly higher heat setting and go for 3 minutes after first crack. Stop and cool just as you get 15 to 20 seconds into second crack. I'll do a roast on Sunday and put up another pic. Or, maybe another video. Wan?

KK, I still intend to do the KKTO video in due time mate.

lmz · February 2014

Ahahah.... Of course I don't mind your cruelty as I know you are fair...and kind >:D Tastewise: all drinkable so far. The first couple of roast with Brazilian were quite average though. The last roast with Brazilian was the best tasting one (even though looked much less even as was done before stirrer arm and heat control) Then I changed To Costa Rica beans which are -to my taste- much stronger with less fruity notes so I use them for my cappuccino. Not as enjoyable as true espresso (no sugar no milk). So I have tried the same beans roasted on the KKTO (big thank you KK). KKTO roast looks perfect but the taste -even though a bit better than my roast- is still in the same strongish notes. All this to say that taste-wise I think I am on the right track. Cannot wait for roasting some Columbian supreme next... Cheers Laurent

GaryatGala · February 2014

The Colombian Supremo was the one i used in the video. They should be an easy bean to roast.:)

lmz · March 2014

Hi Guys, after some short holidays in Tahiti (lucky me) I have been back to my baby roaster. I have finally find a way to use the medium burner and not the larger one. First attempt below... Roast times are pretty consistent. I am getting better at seeing/smelling/listening to the different phases of the roast. Since I have dumped the complicated timers to focus more on the roast itself I have found the process more 'enjoyable'. Taste is quite ok as long as I don't go City Roast or too dark passed the second crack which I did last week and the coffee was undrinkable as espresso). In tahiti they have a choice of 2 for Cappuccinos: French espresso: with bomb cream 'chantilly' or Italian espresso: with frothed milk but not very smooth.... Plunger coffee is everywhere though. cheers Laurent

samuellaw178 · November 2015

on 1392433027:

I don't follow any home roasting equipment threads, so I don't know if anyone has considered trying to either install or place a thermocouple near the heat source or at some stationary point on the Baby Roaster where heat can be measured. This would allow you to monitor, log and review your techniques more accurately and subsequently arrive at ideas for improvements or changes with greater precision.

I know this thread is old but I find many posts here to be very informative (after revisiting). I've installed a thermocouple in my Baby Roaster for a while, and has logged over 70 roasts. I'd say installing the thermocouple had changed the playing field altogether for the Baby Roaster. Without thermocouple, it is more or less hitting blindly in the bush, especially if you roast different beans and aim for drops earlier than second crack. I have a long 100mm stainless steel thermocouple probe, slightly bent so it dips into the bean mass (I am using Gary's pic as a illustration hope he doesn't mind). I had also drilled a hole/slot on the stand so the thermocouple can sit nicely. The thermocouple is secured semi-permanently to the handle by a cable tie and some rubber bands. With this setup, I'm getting first crack at about 200-202C consistently (outlier with some beans like Peaberries), so it's definitely consistent! It allows me to drop at a certain temp with great precision/consistency, and to control the ROR with flame. Though, a caveat is when I use too big of a flame (during the development stage) it seems the temp readout rises faster than the actual BT - if you drop the beans thinking you've reached your target temp it may end up lighter! We shouldn't heat too much during development so that isn't a problem in any way, just an observation. Different beans react differently to the same heat setting - not sure how people are managing it without any thermometry - senses just wouldn't do it! You will be surprised how easy it is to stall the roast, as well as how dynamic the temperatures are during first crack and post first crack (for some beans there're even some interesting phenomenon during the drying stage)! Wouldn't know all that without thermometry. The roasts from Baby roaster are pretty even to my eye - I'm using the manual version and use the flicking method shown by Gary in his video. Pic attached as well, some of the lighter-looking beans are due to chaff and lighting. Here attached is also my latest roast graph logged using RoastLogger. If you wish to achieve consistency on the Baby, please install a thermocouple!

Lwowiak · November 2015

I have had my motorised baby roaster for over 5 years, and lost count of how many roasts I have done. My only modification has been to add a s/s hose clamp to act as a stirrer. I do not see the need for any temp probes, nor do I encourage anyone to add them. With this roaster, you use your senses, and I have learnt a lot more about roasting, then if i was using a probe. As the mass of beans is only 200g, and the copper drum is thin, the results from a probe are only indicative. What a probe will show is exactly what your senses should ascertain. With bean masses of 500g and higher, I can see the need for temp measurement. People using commercial drum roasters have quite an advantage with some of the latest roasting platforms, but they are roasting large batches of beans, so accurate measurement is essential. As stated many times in the past, the baby roaster is a sample roaster. Treat it as such and you will learn a lot. I do a base roast for any new bean, wait a few days and taste the outcome. I then make a few changes via flame management, to test what differences are achieved by roasting quicker or shorter. This info is then used to work out my approach for larger batches on the KKTO.

samuellaw178 · November 2015

on 1447117062:

the results from a probe are only indicative. What a probe will show is exactly what your senses should ascertain. As stated many times in the past, the baby roaster is a sample roaster. Treat it as such and you will learn a lot.

Hi Lwowiak, I understand the results from the probe are only indicative and caveats are taken as such, but they have been very consistent and are indicative of what I want to achieve. I did try using my senses for probably much more than 40+ roasts (previous roaster was HG/BM), but it was hardly consistent for anything less than second crack - I get good roast sometimes and craps the other time. If that's what the Baby Roaster can do, I would have given up back then. I did also try taking notes and logging the milestones etc - it's not easy when you have to drive the roaster, control the flame, shake the roaster, take note of the timer etc. After logging(manually by note-taking) about 20-30 roasts I decided it's a worthless pursue - they're hardly consistent bean-to-bean - once I'm finished with a bean, I have to learn all over again. Another few reasons for installing the thermometry - First, my sense of smell was easily overwhelmed and desensitized by the constant sniffing(not to mention headache). Second, I roast under a kitchen hood and am not comfortable in consuming the potential emission(diacetyl etc) produced from hi-temp roasting. Lastly, I couldn't get consistent result for lighter roast (I enjoy beans not roasted up to second crack) with different beans. I'm just a home user - the baby roaster is my only and main roaster, and so I want consistent & predictable result. I found that installing the temp probe helps achieve that. To give some ideas, this Peru bean I have currently absorbs so much heat that using the same setting barely bring it to first crack. The Brazil has a tendency to speed up after first crack, I wouldn't have known that without a thermometry and as such, can't take a proper measurement to circumvent that and will probably attribute that to bad bean quality. Peaberries absorb so much heat during first crack that my normal flame management would have caused a stalled roast - again, something we wouldn't know without some measurement. To make it harder, I don't have a reference so I wouldn't know how a proper roast of that particular beans would taste like. I may achieve what I discovered by thermometry eventualy, but I would've probably chucked out tons of beans by that time - or accustom myself to drinking all those bad batches. It's like making espresso - some swear by ballparking the dose, temp, and pressure. I don't doubt for a second that will work. But the only way to increase consistency is to have some proper indicators (by measuring them, but not get absorbed by the numbers). Another advantage to newbie roaster(which is me!) is that - you can condition your sense of smell to the phase of roasting (as indicated by temperature). Without long roasting experience behind me, I do not know how drying phase, different development phase etc smell like - they all smell like roasting coffee, different but it's hard to tell. But to be honest, I don't like smelling them. Having myself smell like a walking roaster plant afterward is bad enough, I don't want to sniff them inside my body too. :P

Brett H · November 2015

Love it!! Thank you for the bonus photos too!!

GaryatGala · November 2015

I,m still waiting for the cheque to arrive in the mailbox! [emoji13]

mycuppa · November 2015

IMO using smell as a guide is over-rated and I'm sorry but I can't help laughing at all those video and photos of roaster's sniffing the beans at various stages from their trier's. I use this in the context of commercial roasters, not home roasters. I can appreciate that additional senses may be needed for those without the equipment and logging controllers (computers or accurate thermocouples) but my view is that if you are seeing or smelling something then it's too late I'm afraid to control or manage your roast as you absolutely have to be "ahead and in front of" a roast rather than reacting or responding to it. Along with a time counter, the current air/humidity values I also need to use 4 active temp readings to drive my systems (Bean, Drum, Air and Exhaust) with 2 of these temp readings being fundamentally critical, along with a min. 1-second sample-rate (real time) output screen (or 2x screens actually). I simply cannot do this blind without all of the telemetry systems in place and if I detect even the slightest deviation at any point during the roast which can occur in the heat-up initial batches, I am all over it in a flash. There is no way you can achieve this same accuracy using stage-based sensory skills alone.

Brett H · November 2015

No doubt Jeff and one only need sample your results to enjoy the very clear elements that you've realised from a bean or blend. That's your gift and that you do it with an amount of beans that I can't even comprehend let alone imagine. My joy as a home roaster is very different.... for me, its that every batch is different. Sometimes infinitesimally so but different none the less. That's I suppose why I have a machine with a PID. I'm fickle, I like change and I gave up on data-loggers when I gave up on CoffeeSnobs and pretending I could compete in a shoot-out with a professional. For starters, I can't... and secondly I've nothing to prove because if I want the very best beans to impress someone with, I order them from MyCuppa or Cosmorex (wife still talks about that Yirg). I suppose what I'm trying to say is that I approach my roasting as some sort of cathartic rustic artisanal (despite the electrically powered home fashioined copper agitator and Kogan heat source) pursuit that is more about the glass of red I drink with it and less about conforming to a roast plan. I suppose I can afford to think like this because I don't stuff many roasts but in 20 years of home roasting I've had my share of mishaps as my apprenticeship. Unlike DB I don't drink them! Also along my journey at one point I was data-logging my roasters all the way down to my ridiculous poppers so the groundwork was there in some form or other. Now, I've finally embraced laziness and anti-pedantry by sailing by the seat of my batch-size and the turbo oven knob (Jeff by now is undoubted breathing into a paper bag chanting 'I am on a beach, I am on a beach......). Our little home roasters are so much fun (stay on topic, stay on topic....) and once you follow a few simple guidelines quite forgivable. Let's not all forget that as hobbiests it's as much about the glass of red as the spreadsheets. Disclaimer: I have an engineering friend who would tip the coffee beans in the garden and find his bliss in the xls macros he could write to collate and graph the data, then celebrate with a Coke Zero. Each to his or her own!

mycuppa · November 2015

I hear you Brett and totally get what you are saying. Used to think the same way when I surfed the waves around Newcastle beaches. It was just about Freestyling and total enjoyment

samuellaw178 · November 2015

on 1447140270:

I,m still waiting for the cheque to arrive in the mailbox! [emoji13]

Eh??? I thought you were going to send me one for the 'free' public promotion? :rofl:

CoffeeWala · November 2015

My two cents: I'm very jealous of anyone who can actually log BT. If you can do it reasonably easily with your device, why wouldn't you? I've gone through the most frustrating couple of months trying to roast some Daterra beans on the Behmor which just never seems to fail in incinerating them, no matter what permutation of heat application I use. If only I could see BT I would probably be able to improve a lot faster without wasting so much, and it is a terrible shame to waste such good coffee. I've noticed a bit of a romantic motif of 'roasting with your senses' underlying the Baby Roaster posts I've seen on this forum and others. To my ear sounds a bit like repetition of a marketing spiel. Aside from how I feel after the roast when I sit too close to the roaster (diacetyl/sublimated caffeine high), I don't think anyone should be encouraged to smell that smoke, I'm no doctor but it is almost certainly carcinogenic.

Brett H · November 2015

Oh no CW... You are spot on! Don't smell.... BLURK.... look and listen. What seriously could anyone be smelling for??

Lwowiak · November 2015

on 1447279749:

I've noticed a bit of a romantic motif of 'roasting with your senses' underlying the Baby Roaster posts I've seen on this forum and others. To my ear sounds a bit like repetition of a marketing spiel. Aside from how I feel after the roast when I sit too close to the roaster (diacetyl/sublimated caffeine high), I don't think anyone should be encouraged to smell that smoke, I'm no doctor but it is almost certainly carcinogenic.

Obviously everyone has misunderstood what Mark from CRA meant, but hey, everyone is entitled to their own opinions and their own interpretations of data, supposed fact etc..... Just like those who believe in global warming. I have used the baby roaster for 5 yrs, and roast with my senses, one of them being common sense. I don't roast inside the house, but in a well ventilated garage. I do not sit with my nose plastered 5cm from the roaster either. I roast in the evenings, and this allows me to control the flame with extreme accuracy, it also enables me to see when smoke is emitted. There are many sites which list the process a bean undergoes during roasting, including photos. I found it simple (but as I have stated, everyone processes information differently) to learn what is expected at various stages of the roast, and apply this knowledge. I know exactly when certain stages of the roast are reached, by utilising the sense of sight and smell. An early benchmark of the roast occurs around 4-5 minutes, the first wisp of smoke. This represents a stage has been reached, and allows you to assess the speed and progress of the roast. Further smoke is released at another stage, also signifying a step in the process. Just prior to first crack, a whole lot happens, including the release of smoke which has a particular smell, that can be assessed from a distance. First crack is easily evidenced by sound and smoke. The process continues. Prior to second crack, copious amounts of smoke are released. These and other benchmarks are used to understand the speed and progress of the roast, which is easily adjusted (instantaneously). This info and practice (and some light reading) is all I use to consistently churn out high quality coffee. I find the KKTO even easier to use. I followed the simple advice given by the designer. Comparing a 200g baby roaster to a 30kg+ commercial roaster makes as much sense as talking sense to tree huggers. It is like trying to compare, driving a Vespa to driving a semi trailer. 30kg of beans behaves differently, and needs analysis. 200g is a piddly amount with too many variables. As to Brazil Daterra, I have used this bean in many blends, I rate it as very nice, and the absolute basic bean to use from Brazil. I prefer and roast others, but they are microlots, and have much higher cupping scores. I think I will keep my recipe for Brazil beans under wrap, as no doubt it will be ridiculed as voodoo.

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